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My recent adventures continued….

by Verleen
(Seattle)

For some reason on my original post, I no longer have an option to add another reply there.

Wray, I wanted to thank you for your help an advice and let you know that I didn't give up and stop the progesterone yet. I said I was going to give it some more time and I am.

I had great improvement yesterday and so far this morning, with just a very small amount of spotting and if the last few days of bleeding I had were my normal cycle, as I suspected, since it had started arriving around the middle of the month, then a little leftover spotting for a day or so afterwards is normal for me.

I did go to the higher amount, because I'm tired of feeling like crap and would like to feel better as fast as possible! :-) And yesterday, I felt great except for some mild breast tenderness.

I did up the Taurine to 2,000mgs and I definitely think you were on to something with the Magnesium and Vitamin D, prior to taking the magnesium even low amounts of D would cause me to feel super irritable, but that's not happening now.

Oh and I wanted to add that there was one situation in which my doctor would have helped me….and that is if I wanted to get pregnant! So, I totally understand why people with PCO are so frustrated.

I definitely DO NOT want to have more children. I am not fond of them and I had one who just recently turned 18, he and I are both happy he's my only child……and of course, even if I did want to, it's not advisable having had heart failure!!! That's some nonsense that I think the medical community needs to stop.

One other symptom that I wanted to add that I had was esophageal spasms. When I first started getting the chest pain from them, it landed me up in the cardiology unit for an EKG and they found nothing wrong. I've had gastritis in the past and have a standing order for prescription antacids, in case I need them, so I was told to try those again for awhile since it was most likely acid related.

However, I started tracking the pattern and shortly realized that when my hormones were majorly out of whack is when it would start happening, then they'd go away for awhile when things settled down. Once I started the progesterone, they got much milder and occurred less frequently. Now, I rarely get them.

Anyway, I'll keep you updated on how things go and if you have any other advice or ideas, please feel free to share!

You can also just add this to my other page, if you'd like.

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Jun 19, 2013
 About the same today....
by: Verleen

A tiny little bit of spotting and breast tenderness, but otherwise really the same. I still feel great! :-)
Jun 22, 2013
 My recent adventures continued….
by: Wray

Hi Verleen I have reported the problem to our server site, as no one can, I can't either. I know they were doing an overhaul of their systems, so maybe this was an unexpected glitch. I will add this to your other page when things are up and running again. It's much better to have it all in one place I find. Very pleased things seem to be looking up, you are very impatient! But then I don't blame you, I wish I'd known about using high amounts when I started it, but no, so I slugged away at the usual low amounts. Took months before I was better. Whether I got oestrogen dominance or not I have no idea, my symptoms were so bad they probably disappeared amongst those I had. I'm delighted you found that difference by adding the magnesium. It's so important, and most of us have low levels as it's low in our soil. You might like to look over these sites, the best I've found for vitamin D and it's co-factors, see the Vitamin D Council and GrassrootsHealth. You do come up with interesting snippets! This time on the oesophageal spasms. I had one irate woman telling me it was the progesterone causing them, needless to say she was not using Natpro! I pointed out it should actually cure them, as oestrogen causes smooth muscle to constrict, whereas progesterone relaxes them. Up to that point I had never experienced them. But last year I did, I was under a lot of stress, most of it self generated. So I know all about them. At one point I was considering getting out of bed, it was night time, and going to a pharmacist to get an asthma pump as my chest was closing up! How the spasm affected my trachea I've no idea, maybe in sympathy? The pain was intense in my oesophagus, as if I had swallowed something hard and it had become stuck there. Well I covered my throat with the progesterone cream, and kept doing it till I fell asleep. The pain was much lessened the next day, and by evening had gone, as I had applied it hourly. Any hint of it and I rub it over my throat. So I'm delighted you too found it's helped yours. Take care Wray
Jun 25, 2013
 Hi, Wray!
by: Verleen

I'm still doing well, though I'm on an antibiotic for awhile due to a Bartholin's cyst, so I'm hoping that doesn't screw with me too much.

Still having very mild hot flashes, just a sensation of warmth in my face, mild breast tenderness and some irritability.

However, one of the supplements is making me very nervous/anxious. I'll feel fine, until after I take Taurine and NAC mid-morning and it's getting very bad, I really can't handle it.

Any ideas which one?

I'm thinking of maybe cutting out the Taurine first to see if that resolves it?!?
Jun 26, 2013
 Thanks! :-)
by: Wray

Hi Verleen Well I'm amazed you've found the spotting seemingly stopping. Others have found it can take many weeks to resolve. Maybe the addition of those supplements did the trick. As your heart is very sensitive to supplements, please increase them very slowly. The only time I don't agree with this method is for progesterone, as that tends to exacerbate things. I do agree about the "easy going, laid back person". Prior to using it I think I would have been classed as an A type personality, I couldn't calm down. Which makes me wonder if such a thing exists, and it's not just an imbalance somewhere. I have found that in most cases emotional symptoms are the first to be helped, whereas the physical can take much longer. Let us know how you get on. Sorry about the delay in replying, but this was on your other page, and I couldn't post it. I'd forgotten you had this page! Take care Wray
Jun 26, 2013
 Hi, Wray!
by: Wray

Hi Verleen Another woman told me the taurine caused her Anxiety, which really puzzled me, as it's an anxiolytic! See here, here, here and here. I suggested she reduced the amount and try only 500mg/day and work up slowly. This seemed to help, maybe you could do the same. I've not heard of NAC causing anxiety either, it is an effective anti-depressant too. If the bleeding problems are sorted out you could reduce the amounts too. I do hope the antibiotics don't affect you too much either. Are you taking enough vitamin D, as infections occur when it's too low. Do you know your level? Let me know if reducing or cutting out the taurine helps, you will leave me baffled if it does! Take care Wray
Jun 27, 2013
 Thanks!
by: Verleen

The spotting hasn't completely stopped, but it's down to a very tiny amount, just drops and some days none. Though more days of spotting than not still... I've picked up and tried the Instead SoftCup, it's great for perimenopausal women or those with irregular bleeding. You can wear it for 12 hours and have mess free sex while using it, it fits like a diaphragm to catch menstrual blood, without absorbing or having the other dangers of tampons. So others may like to give it a shot. It's still plastic, though latex free, but basically as safe and harmless as they could make it.

Due to the still slight spotting and other symptoms I still have, I'm reluctant to lower anything, especially just finishing the antibiotic for that cyst....it's also still there, though much smaller than it was. I'll likely have to see my doc for it next week.

And I'm not completely certain this is due to the Taurine or not.

I'm just still frustrated to have so many symptoms, especially since I skipped 800mgs and took my dose right to almost 1,000mgs. I'm using 11tsps of this cream a day, which should be 962mgs and today will be my 11th day of that.

I'm just not sure what to do here. :-/
Jun 27, 2013
 Vitamin D
by: Verleen

My level was 65 at the beginning of the month, when my cardio checked.

I took a few days off taking it, due to the slightly elevated calcium....then started back when you'd suggested I add Megnesium.....but now I've been off again for a few days, because this antibiotic and magnesium don't work well together.
Jun 28, 2013
 I also wanted to say....
by: Verleen

Wray, it is quite amazing how wonderfully helpful you are to everyone that asks, even if they aren't using NatPro...

I know it has to be frustrating for you to deal with some of these people, I'm sure you can think of one recent person that I'm referring to.....and it's really a testament to what an amazing woman you are that you remain so fair and even tempered, regardless of their attitudes.

I came here for advice and help, which you freely gave. I've taken it and though I get frustrated and impatient, I do understand that it takes some time for natural substances to work....for me things are also sometimes complicated by my health issues. I was also impressed that you made sure to remember them and refer to my heart condition in your recent post.

But I just wanted to say that you are quite fantastic and many of us women who've found ourselves up that certain creek without a paddle really appreciate you. :-)

I intend to stick with what you've advised for awhile and only if things would get dangerously out of hand and require emergency medical attention, will I go seek that, since it would be ridiculous to expect you to be a full doctor. LOL

Much love and hugs! Thank you!
Jun 29, 2013
 Vitamin D
by: Wray

Hi Verleen It can take time for all symptoms to resolve, some have used amounts of 1000-1400mg/day for over a year before theirs did, not sure if I gave you these, see here, here here. I do know the menstrual cup, unfortunately it only came out in time for my daughter and friends to use it, not me! These are two I know Mooncup and SoftCup. Seems this last is maybe the one you're using. The cream you are using is very weak, it only contains 17mg/ml of cream, it must be costing you a fortune, besides being very difficult to apply that much! Please take a look at ours here. Take care Wray
Jun 29, 2013
 I also wanted to say....
by: Wray

Hi Verleen I'm so touched by what you've said and feel blessed too. I always need feedback even if bad, but didn't expect this, thank you! I do get down many times, as I repeat myself endlessly, and it helps me so much when others also make a comment, as you did on that particular page. There have been times when I feel I can no longer answer people using another brand, but knowing how little help there is out there, I feel compelled to answer them. But I could really do without the time wasters, and I think in future I won't answer those, or get embroiled as I did here. There are so many pages on our site I need to update, many I did back in 1997 and with a rudimentary internet back then, I relied on books, but now I feel embarrassed to read them! And yet I don't have the time. The work fascinates me, particularly when someone like you comes along with, for me, intriguing symptoms and the causes of them. I love doing the research behind it, finding the pieces to the puzzle. Whether right or wrong only time will tell! So thank you for going along with it, always bearing in mind that they are only suggestions, albeit natural and therefore no harm should come of it. PS I asked you to take a look at the Natpro, forgetting the comments on your other page! Bless you Verleen and much love and hugs to you too. Take care Wray
Jul 03, 2013
 Hi, Wray!
by: Verleen

I'm glad if what I said made you smile! :-)

And I did order some NatPro, I'll be using a combo of both creams for awhile, because I've already invested in a ton of the other.

I wasn't on, because I wasn't feeling well for a few days.

I also think some of my anxiety and irritability was caused by a garlic supplement I was taking. It turns out it can cause that in some people and it eased up as soon as I quit taking it.

As to everything else, I had 5 days of no spotting at all, then it returned this morning. I'm not sure if it's related to being sick, but I really don't think so, because I've also been feeling a little emotionally off and getting mild flushes again after a break of a few days.

Seems I'm still fighting estrogen even after 16 days on the higher dose.

I really can't afford to raise it again right now, which is okay, since I think my being consistent for awhile is vital.

It's still so frustrating and I'm really hoping I don't have to waste money to go see my doc and try to beg for help.
Jul 04, 2013
 Hi, Wray!
by: Wray

Hi Verleen Ah I think I became a bit muddled! It's a pity you had a break from it though, as that allows oestrogen to rise again, with all it's attendant symptoms. Which it seems you did get. And please don't give up yet, re-read those comments I gave you from other women using high amounts. It took some of them many moons to come right. Consistency is vital, no doubt about that. You might like to read part of Liz's comment about this aspect, see here. Scroll to Jun 22, 2013 Update Concerns. Take care Wray
Jul 05, 2013
 Yes, you misunderstood….
by: Verleen

I was still using the progesterone while I wasn't feeling well, I just meant that I wasn't online those days, which is why I hadn't responded yet.

I didn't stop taking it, until the day I posted and realized I'd gotten my regular cycle, after just a 5 day break from the spotting.

At that point, I realized that it only makes sense to take a break from it during my period to see if it stops normally and the spotting stops. My doctor won't even see me for it, if it may be due to using the higher amount of Progesterone, I have to be off of it for a week or two to see if the situation resolves on its own, first. If it doesn't, then I can make an appointment.

I never got the continual spotting, until I went to a higher amount of progesterone and tried to use it straight through, without a break. When I used it a lower amount the first few months, but took a break, my cycle was fine and only varied by a few days.

I was doing some searching on this site and others and discovered that I am not the only one who experienced spotting when they tried to use progesterone cream, regular HRT or contraceptives continuously, without taking a break. I remember the same thing happening to me, when I was on BCP and tried to skip my period week.

Thus, I am only being logical and really, none of my other symptoms had changed between using a lower dose and taking a break, or using the higher dose straight through.

I also wasn't doing well on the daily higher amount. I was getting very sick, because it was keeping me far too dehydrated. I dropped to only 115 pounds and I'm 5'7". I just couldn't keep up with the fluid loss, which started causing nausea, dizziness and etc.

If this period stops in another few days, as it should, then I'll go back on it later in the month, trying to follow my cycle again for awhile to see how that works, at a lower dose. I realize it may be difficult to do, since I'm in peri, but it would be better than the regular spotting and being sick from dehydration, since that puts me in danger.

I also understand that a lower dose used cyclically will mean symptoms will take longer to resolve, but I do have to be careful.

It may also be that I do better on the NatPro, once it arrives and I try it later, because it could be that the one I have been using isn't consistent in the progesterone content.

:-)
Jul 08, 2013
 Yes, you misunderstood….
by: Wray

Hi Verleen Well it seems I've lost the plot somewhere, between the server site troubles and the three pages you have now! I work offline when replying, typing my reply on to a text document which I always save and then paste the answer onto the website. Now I see I've put two comments from you on my text page, and haven't saved the URL for the one. So now I've made myself even more confused! I understand what you're saying above though, so try it out and let me know how you get on. Progesterone is an excellent diuretic, so it could make you dehydrated, although you're the first I've heard suffering from that!

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